Obama assassination plot foiled

August 10, 2008

MIAMI — A man who authorities said was keeping weapons and military-style gear in his hotel room and car appeared in court today on charges he threatened to assassinate Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama. Raymond Hunter Geisel, 22, was arrested by the Secret Service on Saturday in Miami and was ordered held at Miami’s downtown detention center without bail today by a federal magistrate.

A Secret Service affidavit charges that Mr. Geisel made the threat during a training class for bail bondsmen in Miami in late July. According to someone else in the 48-member class, Mr. Geisel allegedly referred to Mr. Obama with a racial epithet and continued, "If he gets elected, I’ll assassinate him myself."
Mr. Obama was most recently in Florida on Aug. 1 and 2 but did not visit the South Florida area.

Another person in the class quoted Mr. Geisel as saying that "he hated George W. Bush and that he wanted to put a bullet in the president’s head," according to the Secret Service.

Mr. Geisel denied in a written statement to a Secret Service agent that he ever made those threats, and the documents don’t indicate that he ever took steps to carry out any assassination. He was charged only with threatening Mr. Obama, the presumptive Democratic nominee, but not for any threat against Mr. Bush.
Mr. Geisel’s court-appointed attorney declined comment. The charge of threatening a major candidate for president or vice president carries a maximum prison sentence of five years.

The Obama campaign declined comment today on the alleged threat.

In the interview with a Secret Service agent, Mr. Geisel said "if he wanted to kill Senator Obama he simply would shoot him with a sniper rifle, but then he claimed that he was just joking," according to court documents.

A search of Mr. Geisel’s 1998 Ford Explorer and hotel room in Miami uncovered a loaded 9mm handgun, knives, dozens of rounds of ammunition including armor-piercing types, body armor, military-style fatigues and a machete. The SUV, which has Maine license plates, was wired with flashing red and yellow emergency lights.

Mr. Geisel told police he was originally from Bangor, Maine, and had been living recently in a houseboat in the Florida Keys town of Marathon, according to court documents. He said he used the handgun for training for the bail bondsman class, had the knives for protection and used the machete to cut brush in Maine.
In the affidavit, the Secret Service said Mr. Geisel told agents that he suffered from psychiatric problems including post-traumatic stress disorder, but he couldn’t provide the names of any facilities where he sought treatment.

Freedom of speech does not include being able to say that you promise you’re going to commit homicide.
this just struck me as odd

The charge of threatening a major candidate for president or vice president carries a maximum prison sentence of five years.

so if it was ralph nader it would be a lesser punishment?

this just struck me as odd

so if it was ralph nader it would be a lesser punishment?

oh you bet… a legal punishment is directly related to the amount of media coverage the case gets… or related to the annoyance factor of the perp.

Unless someone has tried to commit the crime they are talking about, it’s Orwellian to lock someone up for 5 years because they said they were going to do something.

this just struck me as odd

so if it was ralph nader it would be a lesser punishment?

the perp would get a dried fruit basket

Freedom of speech extends only to the point where you do not infringe on another person’s right of safety under a reasonable interpretation.

When you have stock piles of heavy grade weaponry in hotel room and are threatening to assassinate a polarizing figure, I believe that would constitute an infringement of Obama’s right to safety under a reasonable-person’s test and therefore be considered a crime.

Sorry, but read up on your rights before you say that. Freedom of speech does not include death threats. That threat is an infringement of a person’s right to life and safety via Amndt. 1

wtf, no.

So if someone said they were going to do another 9/11 you’d be willing to let them try before wanting to stop them by putting them in jail?
Thought police.

Dude was training to be a bondsman - the shit he had on him is not out of the ordinary.

wtf, no.

So if someone said they were going to do another 9/11 you’d be willing to let them try before wanting to stop them by putting them in jail?

Of course, yo.

What true libertarian wouldn’t? What’s a few thousand lives next to the freedom to say "I’m going to blow up a building with thousands of people inside?"
I bet they’ll find some Hannity or O’Reily or Rush propaganda in his home

Yeah chief, so you wouldn’t call the police if someone on the phone called in and said they were going to kill you and your family? More importantly, you wouldn’t want that man arrested?

adrunkgerbil is libertarian, he has 15 guns in his house just in case someone attacks him

So a handgun with a couple of spare mags, a few knives, and a machete is considered stock piles of heavy grade weaponry??

You read the part that said he wanted to shoot Bush too… right?

There’s just no pleasing some people.

that you promise you’re going to commit homicide.
How is that shit illegal? He never directed the threat at Obama. He was talking out of his ass.
and this wasn’t even a plot. fucking stupid thread title.

In a hotel room? Yes, I’d say that’s pretty excessive

Damn, you do stand up too?

this just struck me as odd

so if it was ralph nader it would be a lesser punishment?

take out ron paul and you could be appointed ambassador

So when I leave my house carrying my sidearm, a spare mag, and my pocket knife it’s excessive? This is nothing more then media sensationalism trying to scare the sheep.

I misconstrued the first paragraph. I’d say "military-style gear" sounds somewhat damning though considering the circumstances.

Regardless, that part is somewhat extraneous. Uttering death threats against a major presidential candidate infringes upon that person’s safety and is doubly egregious considering any harm to that candidate would harm America’s entire political process. The guns, ammo and military-grade equipment may be used as evidence of intent to upgrade the crime to a more serious one.

You’ve taken the premises of an argument out of context to create a strawman.

First of all, the man carrying that sidearm was uttering genuine (at least interpreted by those around him) death threats against a major presidential candidate.

Second, possessing a sidearm is not at all excessive. It is only when you have someone uttering death threats and possessing a sidearm and ammo at a hotel (presumably nearby where Obama is speaking) is it considered evidence of some intent. Of course it could mean nothing; the man could simply be armed at all time and happened to vacation at a Miami hotel with no intention of offing Obama. This is where a reasonable person must interpret the probabilities.

You’ve taken the premises of an argument out of context to create a strawman.

First of all, the man carrying that sidearm was uttering genuine (at least interpreted by those around him) death threats against a major presidential candidate.

Second, possessing a sidearm is not at all excessive. It is only when you have someone uttering death threats and possessing a sidearm and ammo at a hotel (presumably nearby where Obama is speaking) is it considered evidence of some intent. Of course it could mean nothing; the man could simply be armed at all time and happened to vacation at a Miami hotel with no intention of offing Obama. This is where a reasonable person must interpret the probabilities.

My point is the playing up of some pretty minor things in his possession. The threats shouldn’t have been ignored. Only an idiot would go around stating he wanted to shoot a presidential candidate.
I hope they do some investigating and figure out what his actual intentions were. If he just said something stupid/outlandish but had no intention of actually doing anything… then I hope he gets a stern slap on the wrist and is sent on his way (maybe he should lose his right to have guns, as a precaution). If they find some evidence that he was actually planning something down the line (having a gun is not evidence of this) then I hope they nail his ass.

Without knowing anything else other than what the article said, I’m guessing he is just an idiot with a big mouth. But who knows.
What a load of crap. I bet he wouldn’t have been arrested if he said he was going to shoot the president of Iran.

I bet if he was in Iran he would have.

in iran he would have been executed by now by the govt

Seriously, he probably would have been execute already if he was IN Iran saying he was going to kill the Iranian President.

I hope they do some investigating and figure out what his actual intentions were. If he just said something stupid/outlandish but had no intention of actually doing anything… then I hope he gets a stern slap on the wrist and is sent on his way (maybe he should lose his right to have guns, as a precaution). If they find some evidence that he was actually planning something down the line (having a gun is not evidence of this) then I hope they nail his ass.

Without knowing anything else other than what the article said, I’m guessing he is just an idiot with a big mouth. But who knows.

.

He was nowhere near Obama, and didn’t appear to be taking decisive steps to carry out the "threat".

Sounds like some idiot spouting bullshit.

I don’t support Obama, but I’d never wish harm on him or his family. He’s probably a helluva nice guy, I just strongly disagree with [this week's version of] his policies/stances.

probably a ron paul supporter
When did a handgun, body armor, fatiques, and some knives become a heavy military grade armory? I hate people that eat up this sensationalist news propaganda bullshit.

It reminds me of a white trash family down in Arizona that was caught selling drugs and the news media showed 2 pistols and acouple clips on the table and they were droaning on about the massive weapons cache found in the home. I almost died of laughter. If the government or news were to see the kind and amount of weapons my friends own, they’d think a revolution was upon us.

this just struck me as odd

so if it was ralph nader it would be a lesser punishment?

well do you really think "i want to kill Roger Calero of the Socialist Worker Party" should get the same level of respect as McCain/Obama ?

I hope they do some investigating and figure out what his actual intentions were. If he just said something stupid/outlandish but had no intention of actually doing anything… then I hope he gets a stern slap on the wrist and is sent on his way (maybe he should lose his right to have guns, as a precaution). If they find some evidence that he was actually planning something down the line (having a gun is not evidence of this) then I hope they nail his ass.

Without knowing anything else other than what the article said, I’m guessing he is just an idiot with a big mouth. But who knows.

When you’ve been on record multiple times apparently stating that you’ll kill Obama, and then you turn up within close vicinity with things like guns, ammunition and body armor, and THEN claim that you’re psychologically ill, I don’t think your arguments will hold much water.

I don’t think "being on the other side of the same state" = ‘close vicinity’…

Yeah, because it’s a good idea to book a hotel room right next to the person you’re going to kill, right? That doesn’t raise suspicion at all. Let alone the coincidence of traveling to the same state at the same time is also fine, right?

The facts of the matter are this: he made a death threat, he was found nearby with guns, ammo and armor and said that he has psychological issues. Done deal.

Yeah, because it’s a good idea to book a hotel room right next to the person you’re going to kill, right? That doesn’t raise suspicion at all. Let alone the coincidence of traveling to the same state at the same time is also fine, right?

The facts of the matter are this: he made a death threat, he was found nearby with guns, ammo and armor and said that he has psychological issues. Done deal.

Miami is not "near" northern Florida.

Basides, it’s not far from Marathon, where the guy had been living.

I’m not defending the idiot, and if he really was trying to carry out the "threat", throw the book at his dumb ass.

But if his threat centered around Obama being "elected", I’d say he’s a bit premature. Besides, where will Obama be on election night? I doubt it’ll be South Florida.

Freedom of speech extends only to the point where you do not infringe on another person’s right of safety under a reasonable interpretation.

When you have stock piles of heavy grade weaponry in hotel room and are threatening to assassinate a polarizing figure, I believe that would constitute an infringement of Obama’s right to safety under a reasonable-person’s test and therefore be considered a crime.

Simply saying you are going to do something, even kill another person, is not infringing on anyones’ "right" to safety.

Moreover, there is no right to safety. There is, however, a right to defend yourself if necessary.

A completely free country isn’t completely safe; either take the proper precautions or deal with the consequences.

I hope they do some investigating and figure out what his actual intentions were. If he just said something stupid/outlandish but had no intention of actually doing anything… then I hope he gets a stern slap on the wrist and is sent on his way (maybe he should lose his right to have guns, as a precaution). If they find some evidence that he was actually planning something down the line (having a gun is not evidence of this) then I hope they nail his ass.

Without knowing anything else other than what the article said, I’m guessing he is just an idiot with a big mouth. But who knows.

By actual evidence I am talking about the cops doing some real police work, such as interviewing this idiots’ friends, maybe doing some surveillance for a little bit to see what he does and what his deal is. If, during the course of an investigation, he is found to be actually planning on assassinating Obama, then charge him with conspiracy to commit murder. Otherwise it is a witch hunt.

I wonder what some of you would say about my hardware collection and what goes into my travel bag

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